Side casting/fishing and low trees

[Deleted]

Hi All,
Have quietly been plugging away since the day with Ishigaki san last year and have had lots of fun and caught lots of fish. A thing that I can't get comfortable with on the quick skinny rivers that I fish is strike detection under low trees or obstacles. Not so much the casting - can put the fly where I want it side casting but fly first and fly only presentation seems impossible (no space to lift anything clear) and staying in touch really hard as only way to do so seems really (!) fast sideways tracking with the rod. With conventional gear, would just strip line but am wondering if anyone's found a bit of magic to fish in these circs with tenkara. 

Any info. Much appreciated.
Many thanks in advance,
steve

[Paul G]

You generally have to lay line on the water and then track the point at which line and water meet.
You can still make the fly land first, it is followed by the line fairly soon after.

Other alternatives are to stand in such a position that when your fly lands it is in current that flows away from you. That way you can anchor it in place for longer and even lift the line clear in many cases (to achieve a fly only presentation).

[dbl]

I have been struggling with this on local overgrown streams I often fish. Two things have helped me, although they are work arounds rather than ideal practice. First, if possible, use a shorter rod length (say 10 ft) and keep the line, including tippet, slightly shorter than the rod. (John Tyzack's Fish On video on conventionally fishing small streams, recommends an 8ft rod with a line length, including tippet, the same length as the rod, so there is little difference in the reach).
Secondly, deal with the problem that a level line will tend to sink above the join if laid flat. At the moment I use a short greased braided indicator between the tippet and the line so to delay the sink and help to identify a take. A furled line can be greased to float if you prefer. (However, snagging a furled line in a tree is not fun). A copolymer level line might work better, but I haven't tried that.
As Paul says, if you can position yourself so that the current flows away from you, then you can use the tension to keep the line aloft, or, at least, taut.

[JP]

The thing to remember when fishing an overgrown stream is, there will always need to be compromises which take you away from optimum presentation. This applies no matter what method of fishing you choose.

The key is to look for ways to minimize the compromises. Without actually seeing the streams your fishing or the way your approaching them it's difficult to give you a definitive answer but take a look at the video below where me and Paul are fishing a reasonably overgrown stream.

Our approach is to try and position ourselves in the less overgrown spots to try and fish into the more overgrown spots. Downstream techniques can really pay off as mentioned above. The key advantages to downstream presentation when used correctly include;

- the presentation ends up being "fly first" in that it is the fly that reaches the fish ahead of any tippet or casting line.
- although there is line on the water it is easier to avoid unnatural looking drag often associated with line on the water/upstream presentations
- the current often maintains tension for take detection even with some of the casting line on the water

The big disadvantage of downstream presentation on such small streams is you'll often risk putting yourself in the fish's line of sight. The best way to overcome this is to look for natural "screens" to put between you and the fish. This could be solid/permanent things like boulders and rocks or it could be less tangible things like a "curtain" of turbulent water obscuring your movements.

Hope this helps.

[springerman]

Great video JP. Very useful information. Thank you.

Ian.

[daves]

The stream on the video is pretty open compared to some of the places I fish with Tenkara. As JP says there is always likely to be a compromise in such places. I opt for the short rod (8 or 9' max), very short line approach & either use a very light fluorocarbon line (2 weight) greased with Payette paste that JP recommended to me, or a 2.5 weight (0.35mm) copolymer line graded up for places where I have to lay line on the water. Bow & arrow casting can be the best way to get an accurate fly-first cast in overgrown spots.

[adric]

Hi All

When I fish small streams I use an 8 foot rod but use a longer furled leader. I spend most of my time side casting and often cast under the rod tip. I always fish upstream as I am usually in the water because the banks of the streams I fish are so tree lined. I think it is essential to get as low as possible when fishing this type of stream.

typical small stream

[phil]

Hi Steve

Can echo all the fab advice above.

I have found it possible when trees and shrubs lie immediately behind me to roll cast and belgian cast with a 360 cm tenkara rod and level-line into difficult lies. Water hauls to present the fly upstream again at the end of the drift work well too.

Enjoy the challenge.

Happy tenkara

Phil

[Deleted]

Many thanks all for the excellent advice, will have a play. Am going to resist using shorter rods as far as I can but still lots to try. Admit I don't often 'commit' to downstream presentation - on really small streams difficult to fish up and then down without spooking fish and I rarely approach a stream or a stretch with the express intent of fishing downstream. Maybe should a bit more.

[Paul G]

Steve, you can either pick which direction, on average, will ive you the best presentation and then work either up or downstream accordingly - missing out any unsuitable water on the way. If you fancy it, you can drop in on a few likely spots on your way back to the car when they are likely to have recovered from any previous disturbance.

Alternatively, you can set up little downstream loops to fish I.e. Get out of river and walk upstream to next nearest sensible access point and then fish back down to your previous position.

That way you can do a kind of 'running stitch' progression upstream.

:-)